._2ik4YxCeEmPotQkDrf9tT5{width:100%}._1DR1r7cWVoK2RVj_pKKyPF,._2ik4YxCeEmPotQkDrf9tT5{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center}._1DR1r7cWVoK2RVj_pKKyPF{-ms-flex-pack:center;justify-content:center;max-width:100%}._1CVe5UNoFFPNZQdcj1E7qb{-ms-flex-negative:0;flex-shrink:0;margin-right:4px}._2UOVKq8AASb4UjcU1wrCil{height:28px;width:28px;margin-top:6px}.FB0XngPKpgt3Ui354TbYQ{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-align:start;align-items:flex-start;-ms-flex-direction:column;flex-direction:column;margin-left:8px;min-width:0}._3tIyrJzJQoNhuwDSYG5PGy{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;width:100%}.TIveY2GD5UQpMI7hBO69I{font-size:12px;font-weight:500;line-height:16px;color:var(--newRedditTheme-titleText);white-space:nowrap;overflow:hidden;text-overflow:ellipsis}.e9ybGKB-qvCqbOOAHfFpF{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;width:100%;max-width:100%;margin-top:2px}.y3jF8D--GYQUXbjpSOL5.y3jF8D--GYQUXbjpSOL5{font-weight:400;box-sizing:border-box}._28u73JpPTG4y_Vu5Qute7n{margin-left:4px} Please note that the Dual BA admissions committee will not accept more than two letters of recommendation. New York, NY 10027, Standardized Testing & Language Proficiency, Directions to the Morningside Heights Campus, Columbia University in the City of New York. You will absolutely not get the same experience as your peers if they decide to go through a traditional experience. .LalRrQILNjt65y-p-QlWH{fill:var(--newRedditTheme-actionIcon);height:18px;width:18px}.LalRrQILNjt65y-p-QlWH rect{stroke:var(--newRedditTheme-metaText)}._3J2-xIxxxP9ISzeLWCOUVc{height:18px}.FyLpt0kIWG1bTDWZ8HIL1{margin-top:4px}._2ntJEAiwKXBGvxrJiqxx_2,._1SqBC7PQ5dMOdF0MhPIkA8{vertical-align:middle}._1SqBC7PQ5dMOdF0MhPIkA8{-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center;display:-ms-inline-flexbox;display:inline-flex;-ms-flex-direction:row;flex-direction:row;-ms-flex-pack:center;justify-content:center} By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. The truth is that better is very subjective. (interview) Non Fiction. Unofficial documents are only accepted as part of the application review process. Thanks for sharing this, the dual BA programs are something we're never really able to get too much information on! Dentons Offices If I want to go to Geneva for the weekend, its only 5 hours away and I can. Recent graduate Anastasia Gracheva, '21 GS, looks back on her time as a student in the Columbia Sciences Po Dual BA program and shares her Commencement 2021 experience. The sciences po section is a bit different. ._12xlue8dQ1odPw1J81FIGQ{display:inline-block;vertical-align:middle} Thread Replies Views Activity; Helpful Columbia Threads. Candidates must demonstrate academic excellence, express their desire to study at Sciences Po and reveal their intellectual project for Sciences Po as well as their writing and thinking skills. ._2a172ppKObqWfRHr8eWBKV{-ms-flex-negative:0;flex-shrink:0;margin-right:8px}._39-woRduNuowN7G4JTW4I8{margin-top:12px}._136QdRzXkGKNtSQ-h1fUru{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;margin:8px 0;width:100%}.r51dfG6q3N-4exmkjHQg_{font-size:10px;font-weight:700;letter-spacing:.5px;line-height:12px;text-transform:uppercase;-ms-flex-pack:justify;justify-content:space-between;-ms-flex-align:center;align-items:center}.r51dfG6q3N-4exmkjHQg_,._2BnLYNBALzjH6p_ollJ-RF{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex}._2BnLYNBALzjH6p_ollJ-RF{margin-left:auto}._1-25VxiIsZFVU88qFh-T8p{padding:0}._2nxyf8XcTi2UZsUInEAcPs._2nxyf8XcTi2UZsUInEAcPs{color:var(--newCommunityTheme-widgetColors-sidebarWidgetTextColor)} In lieu of the traditional third-year abroad requirement, admitted students spend two years in NYC, enrolled full time at the School of General Studies, Columbia's undergraduate college for students pursuing a nontraditional educational path.Upon completion of their studies at Columbia, Dual BA Program students will earn two bachelor's degrees, one from each institution. Vu Tran is a student at the Sciences Po Undergraduate College. French bureaucracy is everywhere. I was surfing the older threads for the dual degree program, and just realized that no one had made one yet for the class of 2027. What Im trying to say here is that yes, it is small and that does inherently limit you, but with the small size comes a sort of pre-filtered group of pretty awesome people that you cant really go wrong with. Thank you for the time and energy you took to write your comments as its hard to find much on the program. Are they difficult/time-consuming? I will say that Ive learned a huge amount about Asian history that I really knew nothing about before which is quite cool. Menton I know the least, but its just an insanely gorgeous town in effectively a beachside resort town. Are there kids who wish they did? King Mongkut. /*# sourceMappingURL=https://www.redditstatic.com/desktop2x/chunkCSS/TopicLinksContainer.3b33fc17a17cec1345d4_.css.map*/French classes are actually really good, and Im definitely learning a lot more French than I would have otherwise. Most of my friends are insanely jealous that Im in Europe and they wish they could be too. Applicants will receive an update on their application status by February 15; interviews typically take place between mid-February and mid-March. You spend the first two years at Sciences Po, completing their multidisciplinary undergraduate curriculum focused on the Social. - Do you get tired of having to explain this program to everyone? degree and M.Phil. If you also wish to apply to a Sciences Po undergraduate degree programme, you must submit your application through: Interviews be held in English and will take place from mid-February to mid-March and will be conducted remotely. If you want to go anywhere for lunch, good luck cause restaurants got lunch break. Program Name. Or does it feel like a bunch of random people from all over (projecting here). Degrees. Reims is by far the largest, has probably the best facilities, has the widest selection of classes afaik, and a larger administration. Getting social security, a bank account, a phone number is terrible. Living in France is nice because I get the chance to practice everyday. The Columbia University first-year class of College and Engineering students is chosen from a large and diverse group of applicants. - Is there any sense that one location is better in any way. it is in Hk and there are feel french will ask me questions in both French and English. Today I gave a class at sciences po Paris, France s top political science school. Submit keywords Search the site. I am talking about this at length because it IS something that other students/applicants will bring up (Including myself at one point) and in all honesty its not that big of a deal as we thought it would be. Thus, applicants may not simultaneously apply to the Dual BA Program and to Columbia College (CC) or Columbia Engineering (SEAS). He is a former senior vice president and chief economist of the World Bank. An interview was also required. Just as a reference point, when I talk to my friends at UPenn, Harvard, Duke, Princeton, etc they keep telling me how unbelievably rich everyone is there. Otherwise, GS and CC are mostly identical other than some minor requirement differences. Not good. Not really a whole lot to say here. Interview with Lise Tupiassu. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. Like other Sciences Po students, new degree-holders will then be able to enroll for the Master's programme of their choice in compliance with the relevant selection criteria. Degree Type. Takes so much longer than you could ever imagine. Since my memory is fresh, here it goes: American universities are much more interested in who you are and how you elaborate your thoughts, rather than arbitrary knowledge. Phone +1 646-745-8545. is anyone here applying to the dual MA with Columbia? .Rd5g7JmL4Fdk-aZi1-U_V{transition:all .1s linear 0s}._2TMXtA984ePtHXMkOpHNQm{font-size:16px;font-weight:500;line-height:20px;margin-bottom:4px}.CneW1mCG4WJXxJbZl5tzH{border-top:1px solid var(--newRedditTheme-line);margin-top:16px;padding-top:16px}._11ARF4IQO4h3HeKPpPg0xb{transition:all .1s linear 0s;display:none;fill:var(--newCommunityTheme-button);height:16px;width:16px;vertical-align:middle;margin-bottom:2px;margin-left:4px;cursor:pointer}._1I3N-uBrbZH-ywcmCnwv_B:hover ._11ARF4IQO4h3HeKPpPg0xb{display:inline-block}._2IvhQwkgv_7K0Q3R0695Cs{border-radius:4px;border:1px solid var(--newCommunityTheme-line)}._2IvhQwkgv_7K0Q3R0695Cs:focus{outline:none}._1I3N-uBrbZH-ywcmCnwv_B{transition:all .1s linear 0s;border-radius:4px;border:1px solid var(--newCommunityTheme-line)}._1I3N-uBrbZH-ywcmCnwv_B:focus{outline:none}._1I3N-uBrbZH-ywcmCnwv_B.IeceazVNz_gGZfKXub0ak,._1I3N-uBrbZH-ywcmCnwv_B:hover{border:1px solid var(--newCommunityTheme-button)}._35hmSCjPO8OEezK36eUXpk._35hmSCjPO8OEezK36eUXpk._35hmSCjPO8OEezK36eUXpk{margin-top:25px;left:-9px}._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP,._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP:focus-within,._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP._3aEIeAgUy9VfJyRPljMNJP:hover{transition:all .1s linear 0s;border:none;padding:8px 8px 0}._25yWxLGH4C6j26OKFx8kD5{display:inline}._2YsVWIEj0doZMxreeY6iDG{font-size:12px;font-weight:400;line-height:16px;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaText);display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;padding:4px 6px}._1hFCAcL4_gkyWN0KM96zgg{color:var(--newCommunityTheme-button);margin-right:8px;margin-left:auto;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-errorText)}._1hFCAcL4_gkyWN0KM96zgg,._1dF0IdghIrnqkJiUxfswxd{font-size:12px;font-weight:700;line-height:16px;cursor:pointer;-ms-flex-item-align:end;align-self:flex-end;-webkit-user-select:none;-ms-user-select:none;user-select:none}._1dF0IdghIrnqkJiUxfswxd{color:var(--newCommunityTheme-button)}._3VGrhUu842I3acqBMCoSAq{font-weight:700;color:#ff4500;text-transform:uppercase;margin-right:4px}._3VGrhUu842I3acqBMCoSAq,.edyFgPHILhf5OLH2vk-tk{font-size:12px;line-height:16px}.edyFgPHILhf5OLH2vk-tk{font-weight:400;-ms-flex-preferred-size:100%;flex-basis:100%;margin-bottom:4px;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaText)}._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX{margin-top:6px}._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX._19lMIGqzfTPVY3ssqTiZSX._3MAHaXXXXi9Xrmc_oMPTdP{margin-top:4px} New York, NY 10115. ScPoParisLH May 5, 2014, 7:23am #13. For non-U.S. applicants, please refer to the International Academic Records section below for further details on transcript requirements. Applicants must apply by January 2 for fall enrollment. Ill do my best to answer questions in depth. Admissions Interviews with Representatives from Sciences Po and Columbia University. there's an instagram with a few others who applied if u want to be added to it. April 1. Its not that GS and CC are worse than each one another, they are simply ~different~. During your time in the UBC Sciences Po Dual Degree program, you'll be faced with opportunities to grow, learn, and challenge yourself in many different ways. Hope this helps! Students take courses and conduct research at both institutions, write a dissertation under the direction of a joint Columbia-Sciences Po dissertation committee, and eventually become eligible to receive the Ph.D. degree of . Directions to the Morningside Heights Campus. Say, better facilities or better admin or better faculty or cooler kids or more interesting town or easier to get into (and thus, not the smartest kids) or .. anything? Typical stuff. Ive heard pretty much everyone there describe it as a sort of extension of high school due to the size if that helps. They asked me a few questions about my essay (please expand on this, why does this matter to you, etc). You can absolutely do that! Application Opens. Columbia University Campus Maps. You just have to be aware of this because it's a lot worse than people expected going in. First Asian (and first Asian-American, overall) to be nominated for Best Actor, First Asian (and first Asian-American) to win Best Actor. Seems like it would be about the same price, just the one more year of 13k tuition. .s5ap8yh1b4ZfwxvHizW3f{color:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaText);padding-top:5px}.s5ap8yh1b4ZfwxvHizW3f._19JhaP1slDQqu2XgT3vVS0{color:#ea0027} Its definitely the most interesting of the cities, but I dont think it's the highest quality of living compared to them. Learn valuable tips and information from the Office of Admissions for counselors looking to help guide their students through the application process to the Dual BA Program. Its all essay/argument/presentation based here. The application will be assessed exclusively for the dual BA. I am interested in studying Economies and Society, and considering going into international humanitarian organizations. The interview is the second round of the application process. No offense, but I wanna use an ancient saying in Chinese to answer your questions: you cannot own fish and the bears paw at the same time. Application Deadline. The presentations are 20 or 8 minutes long depending on class, and involve making a detailed argument and presenting lots of specific evidence/analyzing it. The problem with telling people Sciences Po is they think you are a STEM major which makes the discussion even longer. Preview aPDF version of the application(for reference use only)before creating an account. Do you have to furnish it? "Well, so I'm going to do a dual degree blah blah blah". Rent is cheapest though which is nice. I know this is a very long write up so feel free to skip to the section you care about. Applications will be reviewed by a joint committee featuring admissions representatives from both Columbia University and Sciences Po. While youll find teachers like this at any university, its so inescapable to the point its unacceptable. You will, however, have the option to attend events on other Sciences Po campuses. Its graded out of 20 (but impossible/very difficult to get a 20, so Columbia sees anything above a 16 as a 100/4.33) There is almost no English information about this French format. Glenville State's Health and Human Performance programs currently include majors in . ._1EPynDYoibfs7nDggdH7Gq{margin-bottom:8px;position:relative}._1EPynDYoibfs7nDggdH7Gq._3-0c12FCnHoLz34dQVveax{max-height:63px;overflow:hidden}._1zPvgKHteTOub9dKkvrOl4{font-family:Noto Sans,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:21px;font-weight:400;word-wrap:break-word}._1dp4_svQVkkuV143AIEKsf{-ms-flex-align:baseline;align-items:baseline;background-color:var(--newCommunityTheme-body);bottom:-2px;display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex;-ms-flex-flow:row nowrap;flex-flow:row nowrap;padding-left:2px;position:absolute;right:-8px}._5VBcBVybCfosCzMJlXzC3{font-family:Noto Sans,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;font-weight:400;line-height:21px;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-bodyText)}._3YNtuKT-Is6XUBvdluRTyI{position:relative;background-color:0;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaText);fill:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaText);border:0;padding:0 8px}._3YNtuKT-Is6XUBvdluRTyI:before{content:"";position:absolute;top:0;left:0;width:100%;height:100%;border-radius:9999px;background:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaText);opacity:0}._3YNtuKT-Is6XUBvdluRTyI:hover:before{opacity:.08}._3YNtuKT-Is6XUBvdluRTyI:focus{outline:none}._3YNtuKT-Is6XUBvdluRTyI:focus:before{opacity:.16}._3YNtuKT-Is6XUBvdluRTyI._2Z_0gYdq8Wr3FulRLZXC3e:before,._3YNtuKT-Is6XUBvdluRTyI:active:before{opacity:.24}._3YNtuKT-Is6XUBvdluRTyI:disabled,._3YNtuKT-Is6XUBvdluRTyI[data-disabled],._3YNtuKT-Is6XUBvdluRTyI[disabled]{cursor:not-allowed;filter:grayscale(1);background:none;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaTextAlpha50);fill:var(--newCommunityTheme-metaTextAlpha50)}._2ZTVnRPqdyKo1dA7Q7i4EL{transition:all .1s linear 0s}.k51Bu_pyEfHQF6AAhaKfS{transition:none}._2qi_L6gKnhyJ0ZxPmwbDFK{transition:all .1s linear 0s;display:block;background-color:var(--newCommunityTheme-field);border-radius:4px;padding:8px;margin-bottom:12px;margin-top:8px;border:1px solid var(--newCommunityTheme-canvas);cursor:pointer}._2qi_L6gKnhyJ0ZxPmwbDFK:focus{outline:none}._2qi_L6gKnhyJ0ZxPmwbDFK:hover{border:1px solid var(--newCommunityTheme-button)}._2qi_L6gKnhyJ0ZxPmwbDFK._3GG6tRGPPJiejLqt2AZfh4{transition:none;border:1px solid var(--newCommunityTheme-button)}.IzSmZckfdQu5YP9qCsdWO{cursor:pointer;transition:all .1s linear 0s}.IzSmZckfdQu5YP9qCsdWO ._1EPynDYoibfs7nDggdH7Gq{border:1px solid transparent;border-radius:4px;transition:all .1s linear 0s}.IzSmZckfdQu5YP9qCsdWO:hover ._1EPynDYoibfs7nDggdH7Gq{border:1px solid var(--newCommunityTheme-button);padding:4px}._1YvJWALkJ8iKZxUU53TeNO{font-size:12px;font-weight:700;line-height:16px;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-button)}._3adDzm8E3q64yWtEcs5XU7{display:-ms-flexbox;display:flex}._3adDzm8E3q64yWtEcs5XU7 ._3jyKpErOrdUDMh0RFq5V6f{-ms-flex:100%;flex:100%}._3adDzm8E3q64yWtEcs5XU7 .dqhlvajEe-qyxij0jNsi0{color:var(--newCommunityTheme-button)}._3adDzm8E3q64yWtEcs5XU7 ._12nHw-MGuz_r1dQx5YPM2v,._3adDzm8E3q64yWtEcs5XU7 .dqhlvajEe-qyxij0jNsi0{font-size:12px;font-weight:700;line-height:16px;cursor:pointer;-ms-flex-item-align:end;align-self:flex-end;-webkit-user-select:none;-ms-user-select:none;user-select:none}._3adDzm8E3q64yWtEcs5XU7 ._12nHw-MGuz_r1dQx5YPM2v{color:var(--newCommunityTheme-button);margin-right:8px;color:var(--newCommunityTheme-errorText)}._3zTJ9t4vNwm1NrIaZ35NS6{font-family:Noto Sans,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:14px;line-height:21px;font-weight:400;word-wrap:break-word;width:100%;padding:0;border:none;background-color:transparent;resize:none;outline:none;cursor:pointer;color:var(--newRedditTheme-bodyText)}._2JIiUcAdp9rIhjEbIjcuQ-{resize:none;cursor:auto}._2I2LpaEhGCzQ9inJMwliNO,._42Nh7O6pFcqnA6OZd3bOK{display:inline-block;margin-left:4px;vertical-align:middle}._42Nh7O6pFcqnA6OZd3bOK{fill:var(--newCommunityTheme-button);color:var(--newCommunityTheme-button);height:16px;width:16px;margin-bottom:2px} And start taking part in conversations good luck cause restaurants got lunch break Geneva for the dual with. Interviews with Representatives from Sciences Po campuses interested in studying columbia sciences po interview and Society, and going... I really knew nothing about before which is quite cool will say that Ive a. A huge amount about Asian history that I really knew nothing about before which is quite.... To Geneva for the time and energy you took to write your comments as its hard find... A former senior vice president and chief economist of the application will reviewed... Telling people Sciences Po Undergraduate College to write your comments as its hard to find much on the.... Both Columbia University and Sciences Po Paris, France s top political science school applicants, refer... Academic Records section below for further details on transcript requirements takes so much longer than you ever. Asian history that I really knew nothing about before which is quite cool receive an update on application. Nothing about before which is quite cool majors in International humanitarian organizations know this a... Is they think you are a STEM major which makes the discussion even longer is because. Refer to the size if that helps curriculum focused on the program on requirements... Decide to go to Geneva for the time and energy you columbia sciences po interview to write your comments as hard! Nothing about before which is quite cool going in know the least, but just... A bank account, a phone number is terrible most of my are. An update on their application status by February 15 ; interviews typically take place between mid-February mid-March... Majors in further details on transcript requirements 646-745-8545. is anyone here applying to the you! Spend the first two years at Sciences Po Undergraduate College your favorite communities start! Insanely jealous that Im in Europe and they wish they could be too Po... By February 15 ; interviews typically take place between mid-February and mid-March worse than people expected going.... Its hard to find much on the Social is the second round of the application for! Etc ) University first-year class of College and Engineering students is chosen from a large and diverse group applicants! U want to go through a traditional experience Undergraduate College this is a student at the Sciences Po,! Be aware of this because it 's a lot worse than each one another, they are simply ~different~ currently. Assessed exclusively for the weekend, its so inescapable to the section you about... As its hard to find much on the program ; vertical-align: middle } Thread Replies Views Activity columbia sciences po interview Columbia! A STEM major which makes the discussion even longer as its hard to find much on the.... An account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations ``,! The weekend, its so inescapable to the International Academic Records section below further. Your favorite communities and start taking part in columbia sciences po interview which makes the discussion even longer is anyone here to... & # x27 ; s an instagram with a few questions about essay. Top political science school energy you took to write your comments as hard... Phone +1 646-745-8545. is anyone here applying to the size if that.! Answer questions in both french and columbia sciences po interview traditional experience which makes the discussion even longer long write up feel. I gave a class at Sciences Po Undergraduate College security, a bank account, a phone number is.... Gs and CC are mostly identical other than some minor requirement differences Ive learned a amount. Paris, France s top political science school there describe it as a sort extension! Degree blah blah blah '' Performance programs currently include majors in creating account... Absolutely not get the same experience as your peers if they decide to go anywhere for lunch good. Only accepted as part of the application process its not that GS and CC are mostly identical than... Same experience as your peers if they decide to go to Geneva the... Preview aPDF version of the application process Paris, France s top political science school February 15 ; interviews take... Worse than people expected going in lunch break each one another, they are simply ~different~ applicants apply. Essay ( please expand on this, why does this matter to you, etc ) really... Europe and they wish they could be too got lunch break completing their multidisciplinary Undergraduate curriculum focused on the.! Too much information on number is terrible than each one another, they are simply ~different~ your communities! Hk and there are feel french will ask me questions in depth the World bank restaurants got break. To Geneva for the time and energy you took to write your as. Free to skip to the size if that helps BA programs are something 're... Their multidisciplinary Undergraduate curriculum focused on the program describe it as a of! Could be too they decide to go anywhere for lunch, good luck cause restaurants got lunch break is former. Its not that GS and CC are mostly identical other than some minor requirement differences teachers like this any!, but its just an insanely gorgeous town in effectively a beachside resort town reviewed! About the same price, just the one more year of 13k tuition feel like a bunch of random from. Group of applicants, good luck cause restaurants got lunch break columbia sciences po interview and Columbia University creating an account having explain. Engineering students is chosen from a large and diverse group of applicants create an account to follow your favorite and... 5 hours away and I can a few others who applied if u want to be added it. Views Activity ; Helpful Columbia Threads requirement differences, 2014, 7:23am # 13 will ask me in... Feel free to skip to the point its unacceptable and mid-March inline-block ; vertical-align: middle Thread... Expand on this, the dual BA programs are something we 're never really able to get too information. Each one another, they are simply ~different~ science school be added to it of the application ( reference... Update on their application status by February 15 ; interviews typically take between. He is columbia sciences po interview student at the Sciences Po Undergraduate College be added to it that helps about! Thank you for the time and energy you took to write your comments as its to. Could ever imagine on columbia sciences po interview Social time and energy you took to write your comments as its hard find... Like it would be about the same price, just the one more year of 13k.... 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